# Media Merger Risks and Trade War Impacts

**Podcast:** Pivot
**Published:** 2026-08-25

## Transcript

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Hi, everyone.
This is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network.
I'm Kara Swisher, and I'm kicking off yet another week of...
Got Free August.
I literally, I would play that all year if I could.
Scott is still away, missing me terribly.
Of course, he hasn't been in touch at all.
He, of course, fancies himself a comedian.
But for today's episode, I brought in the real deal, Roy Wood Jr., Emmy-winning comedian, actor, and producer, and host of CNN's satirical news quiz, which I've been on and will be on very soon, actually.
Have I got news for you.
Welcome, Roy.
Thank you for having me.
You know, and I know that Scott is listening to us in MetaGel in the weight room right now.
And I just want to say to him, you only do two days, the day in, day out, you know, tell the truth.
That's why he's gone this year.
He has to go pay penance.
Well, he allegedly is on vacation.
But I don't know.
I think he's posting a lot more recently.
So he obviously has to weigh in on the news.
He's dying because Natalie Hark is happening right now, which is a problem.
How do you think I feel?
CNN's had me dark for three months.
I know.
That's true.
You've got Trump tapping dead people's caskets.
Yeah.
It's been a lot.
It's been a lot.
Explain the show.
I love your show.
I've been on it several times.
I'll be on it really soon, in a couple of weeks, I think.
For the people who haven't watched it, for 30 years, this show is run in Britain, where the way they disseminate the news is they ask panelists questions.
It's a fake quiz show about current events, and you don't have to know shit.
In fact, it's funnier if you don't.
And by the end of the hour, you, me, Amber Ruffin and Michael Ian Black, we have figured out everything this week.
The way I try to differentiate where Have I Got News sits in the Oliver Daily Show verse of political satire is that we are here to simply tell you what happened.
We don't have the time to get into.
why and who and what is the solution and the deep dive.
We just don't have time because we like to be the show where you need to know what's happening politically with Trump.
But then you also need to know that a dude got himself kicked out of a WNBA game.
And there was a green dildo.
Like, we want to cover the gamut.
Explain the green dildo.
I don't think as a man I can explain.
I don't know.
Why green?
I don't know.
Well, no, you know what?
As a man, probably it is my responsibility.
Yeah, it is.
It ain't the women throwing them.
Like, everyone's like men and trans people in the WNBA.
There's no trans people in the WNBA.
There's just straight men throwing dildos.
So that's the problem.
And then running.
Stand on it.
Yeah.
Stand on it.
If you don't throw a dildo, just say, hey, it was me.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I'd like to have a conversation about politics though.
Yeah.
Would you ever throw a dildo?
I don't know if I'd ever touch a dildo.
They all look used.
You know, it's just, it's a hygiene thing.
It's like if you saw a naked straw.
I just assume it's been in somebody's mouth.
Okay.
But question, why would a man do that?
I mean, it's just like the ladies are having a good time.
Lots of people are having a good time.
If you've been to a WNBA game, they're fun.
Yeah, I've gone to a couple of Liberty games with my son and it's always a great time.
It's packed.
They're chanting, they're yelling.
I mean, I was going back when they were still at Madison Square before they even made the move out to Barclays.
It's a great time.
It's great basketball.
It's great competition.
I don't understand why people are trying to use that sport at its rise.
They're going to get the new CBA.
Caitlin Clark just put up 37 earlier this week.
Angel Reese is doubling, doubling her ass off.
You got the young woman up in Minnesota, the spectacle, which one of the dopest nicknames right now, Madam Miles.
Much respect to the spectacle up there with the Lynx.
I just think that it's just dudes trying to get attention and just bringing attention.
What can get people riled up?
Can I ask a question, though?
Why is it that liberals, and I'll include myself in this bucket, why have we not learned that not reacting is probably a more effective way?
No, dildo is a totally separate thing.
Dildo throwing.
But in the sense of a lot of people that are trying to make a name for themselves by bathing themselves in liberal outrage, we supply the outrage in which they bathe themselves, which makes themselves a right-wing martyr.
And then they're able to build whole media empires off of that.
Yeah, I think that that's nearing an end, I have to say.
Because I think what's interesting is, I was just thinking about this, it's the...
right that whinges all the time now and is very like, what's the, it's like anti-woke, if that makes sense.
And I think the dildos and the throwing is, you know, this is a successful group of women and there's some controversy like in all sports, right?
Men's basketball has had all kinds of controversy.
They just can't stand it.
And so they have to say, look at me.
This issue feels like one that you could kind of, you could kind of starve.
the people who are starved for it.
Yeah, just kick them out of the arena they throw.
Yeah.
Right?
Yeah, just kick them out.
And that's the end of it.
I'm not talking about it.
Go back to your show.
So you're just, so this is what, your third season, fourth season?
This is, this will be number five.
Five?
When we come back in September, this will be, this will be the fifth cycle of the show.
Yeah, so I'm excited.
It's doing really well.
If they wouldn't bring it back, if it wasn't.
But how do you, what do you attribute that to?
I think that we, Number one, I think CNN is the right network for the show because we get to exist on a Saturday night and they pair us with Bill Maher or there's usually like a special interest story or something else going on on that day.
I think that we are light, we are fun, we are fast through the topics.
So you don't necessarily feel like you're consuming.
an entire meal.
I do think comedy has been a lot more pointed, whether it's Oliver or The Daily Show or you guys, than news programs to get to the point of the idiocy surrounding people.
Yeah, because I think comedians are giving a little bit more leeway than the average news anchor.
You know, God forbid you call a spade a spade and you just work for a Sinclair outlet or something.
You know, you working in market 12 or market 20.
they're not going to give you that leeway.
And I think also it's understood that it's comedy because, you know, what's really funny is that I have said stuff on Friday night on Abby Phillip that gets me stared at.
And then I'll do the same joke on Saturday at Have I Got News.
And it gets an applause break.
So I think it's also the comedic expectation.
You know, when Abby, they do the show down at the cooking.
Yeah, the cooking thing.
Food network.
I want to be respectful to the place.
And when we're there, the audience, and also you're with four people who are dead ass serious and they've written notes down all day.
And these are real journalists.
And I'm sitting here looking goofy in a Cubs hat.
I'm trying to crack a joke and they're not with it.
No, some of them are not journalists and they just say things off the top of their fucking head.
You know this is the case.
Nice suits though.
Nice suits and something.
All right, one last question about your show.
Who do you like better, Amber or Michael?
Don't turn this into a race war because you know I'm going to pick the black woman.
You're going to set me up and then they're going to clip this little section in there.
Roy Wood.
Hates black women and never spoke.
No, Michael, I've always known from the standup circuit.
Amber, I've known, you know, I've had a longer, deeper relationship with Amber than I have Michael.
So there's definitely like a synergy.
What's funny on the show is that a guest will say something.
We had Tim Burchett on, right wing Tennessee, Tennessee man.
And Burchett says something over to this side of me.
And in my peripheral on the other side, I see Amber just move.
It's the slightest skosh of a move.
And I go, oh, no, she's going to get him.
Oh, no.
She did?
Just stay out of the way, Roy.
Just stay out of the way.
And I just literally leaned back so her words could fly across the desk.
Oh, my God.
Your temperature?
Good for you.
My hope this year is to have you and Beaumont Jones.
Oh, all right.
On the same episode.
Oh, great.
That's dream episode number one.
Dream episode number two is you with any sitting Republican elected official.
Please, please.
Why?
Why?
Am I good with that?
And Mom Donnie, because you're just supposed to say that because New York.
Maybe I should tweet.
That's how he shows up.
Yeah.
He won't do an interview with me.
He doesn't interview with everybody.
He won't do an interview with me.
I don't know.
You got to tweet about it.
You got to go, I'm done.
You're right.
I know.
I bet you won't show up to this pothole.
Yeah, show up to this pothole.
I called him months and months and months before he won, like six, seven, before he was a thing.
And I just thought he was so interesting.
And I'm just telling you crickets.
I don't know what it is.
Do you think that you, of all the people that have ignored your request for interviews, do you think they are?
Is there any common theme?
Do you think they're intimidated by you?
Do you think like what is it?
I don't know.
Some people like, yes, I think some like Tim Scott, like tear me down a hundred million times and I get it.
I get it.
I also have not a huge amount of regard for how he behaves.
But.
And I say it.
I guess I've said it.
But I would have been fair.
I had Tom Tillis on.
I thought he was great.
And we disagreed completely.
But he had the guts to come on.
And he was actually made some very good points.
And it was a very good, I thought it was a great discussion, even though we didn't agree.
I think the commonality is they think I'm going to get them when, in fact, I end up having much more substantive discussions with people.
And I'm not a gotcha person.
I just, what I do is I say things out loud.
And I suppose with Momdani, I won't.
slather him with idolatry, I guess.
I find a lot of interviews do that.
And then even the right-wing ones, when he goes on those shows sometimes, they sort of are like Trump, they find him charming, right?
He's super charming and has got a lot of star power.
So maybe he thinks, maybe it's Scott Galloway.
He doesn't like Scott Galloway.
I don't know.
I'll blame Scott for everything.
Anyway, let's go.
We got a lot to get.
Today's a great show.
Your show is great.
I'm excited to come on and put me on with whoever you like.
And pardon the bicycles in the background if there's any.
I'm in Amsterdam, so I don't know.
Oh, nice.
Oh, nice.
I love Amsterdam.
There's a lot of bicycles there.
They're very aggressive with the bicycles, actually, when you ride.
I got to the airport, and at the airport, they have, like, literally as you're headed to customs.
there's just a Black dude and a Black woman on a bike.
As you come down the escalators, like, welcome to Amsterdam, and it's Black people riding tandem.
Are you riding bicycles?
Not yet.
No one has on a helmet.
So I'm like, I'm American.
I'm just like, you'll die.
But then I looked at the fatality rates here.
It's like super low.
It's all respected.
Well, they ride very aggressively.
I had a great time doing, but they're super aggressive.
But let's get to the things.
Speaking of other countries, Donald Trump is lashing out at Canada, saying they're among the worst nations in the world to deal with and will no longer be treated like.
will be treated like a state no longer.
They are not a state.
This outburst comes after U.S.-Canada trade talks collapsed late last week when Canada walked away.
And Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney says the U.S.
introduced last-minute demands that were unfair and uneconomic.
And he would know.
banker.
He's run treasuries, everything else.
With no deal, Trump's 50% tariffs went into effect on a range of Canadian goods, including dairy products, alcohol, and hockey equipment.
Trump is also now threatening to increase tariffs on all cars, car parts, and steel from Canada to 50% starting January 1st.
Mark Connage says Canada will retaliate dollar for dollar with tariffs of its own and spoke candid about where the relationship between the two countries stand.
Let's listen.
Why does it feel like today?
Mark Carney is going to war.
Trade war.
The tone.
Because we were attacked.
Like, you're at war when you get attacked.
We got attacked.
Is Canada really a country we want to be going to war with right now?
Or trade war?
War.
Trade war.
No, they aren't.
And I think the U.S.
has really established themselves as, you know, we're the country without a country.
Like, do we have any allies left that aren't begrudging?
And like, had no choice but to be with us because it's an economic disadvantage to not rock with us.
I like Crown Royal.
I hate that it's more expensive.
I know there's bigger issues at stake here when we're talking about- No, but it's part of the thing.
It's part of the thing.
Yeah.
Kind of sucks.
But I think that, I think we live in a time now where just Trump is just like, our government is just going to bully other nations for no reason, even if they don't, even if it doesn't make any sense.
And so, It does not help us.
It also decimates small businesses that do a lot of business across the border.
Both ways.
I don't know.
But I think if you're a candidate at this point, there's no sense in bending the knee.
You may as well just ride this out for the next two years if you're really going to be serious about it.
Right.
Well, maybe just a few months.
You may not have the power to do much of anything.
in November after that.
Yeah, come November.
I also love that he's rescinded the thing that they didn't even want in the first place, which was statehood.
You are no longer invited to my part.
All right.
They do have a conservative movement there, but they have not yet won elections.
They have in certain areas, but it's not Trump conservatism.
One or two people are like that.
Even with the conservative movement, even with the way that American conservative politics have influenced international conservatism, I don't think that anyone in any of these other nations has a desire to be.
America, like there's still prideful people, Canadians, regardless.
So they're not dying to run with us and do everything.
Like, even if you got a full blown conservative, you know, parliament or whatever in Canada, I don't know if that fixes Trump's desire to want to like still kind of, you know, put his pinky on.
Put his pinky on the scale of foreign trade with Canada.
Why is he doing it?
Why do you think he's doing it this time?
I need wins.
And if you're not going to do what I want you to do, then I'm just going to take my ball and go, you know what, I'll show you.
And then more importantly, this is somehow rolled up into a ball in PR and sold to American voters as a win for America.
Because America first.
Yeah, but they're not like that anymore, which is interesting.
One of the things that's really interesting is Canada is one of the few neighbors of countries that hasn't gotten into big wars with their neighbors, right?
They've been excellent neighbors for a long, long, long time.
Anyway, let's move on.
The Paramount-Warner Brothers merger saga continues.
California AG Rob Bonta just called off settlement talks with Paramount, accusing Paramount of acting in bad faith, leaking details of a meeting and misrepresenting discussions.
Bonta is leading the 12 state groups.
It's sued to block the merger.
There's also a separate suit by WGA.
Both cases are set to go to trial in March.
Paramount agreed to pause the deal until the cases play out or until June when the costs are going to start piling up.
They're going to...
They're going to really start piling up in September with these ticking fees, but it doesn't come to fruition by June.
It's another almost $8 billion they have to pay, and the deal would probably be over.
Though Paramount is now asking a judge to make the states and the WGA put up $1.88 billion bond to cover those delay costs, which is unprecedented.
Well, you probably thought you were free of Paramount when you left The Daily Show, but now you're at CNN.
They're pulling you.
But your show is licensed, correct?
It's licensed, but nothing's...
none of this is guaranteed.
They shoot whole movies and then don't release them.
As the cast of Batgirl, it's like me and this Paramount merger, you know that movie It Follows?
Yes.
No matter where you go, it's coming for you.
And then before that, it was the CBS Viacom Comedy Central.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So I can't escape it.
I'm just a merger magnet, baby.
I don't I don't know what this means for CNN as a whole, because I've also heard within this merger talk that there's there's kind of two scenarios.
You know, there was scenario one where CNN wasn't going to be part of it.
Then Ellison came out and said, no, no, no.
We want CNN.
I want it to be run right.
We're going to we promise to keep it neutral and we're not going to.
Fox 2.0.
But then there's also a world where CNN still gets sold off somewhere else.
I think that if we're speaking frankly, I think that's probably the inevitability of the network in terms of Time Warner, not just CNN.
I'm talking Time Warner as a whole being sold in some capacity.
What the new regime wants, that becomes the thing that becomes odd.
I had a sitcom on a hook over at HBO Max that was on the inside track to get a series pickup.
And then the Showtime Max merger thing, the jiggy happened and they cleared the slate.
You know, I was at TBS when Michael Wright took over, I believe in 2013, I believe is when he came in.
And when he came into the network, he essentially canceled everything but Conan O'Brien.
And so.
Having been a part of these different entities where I've been on a show, same with TBS, a show that did well and the show was very safe and the show was really loved.
I don't know how much all of that really counts anymore.
You know, you look at Wonder Man that was canceled by, I think, was it Disney Plus?
Yeah, it's a Marvel show.
And then they put out the viewing numbers.
two weeks later.
And it's like these numbers, clearly billions of hours.
This show should have gotten another season.
So, you know, I don't know.
I definitely the thing that I hate the most about all of this is what it does in terms of uncertainty for staff.
You know, as talent, I'm afforded a lot more leeway.
I can go travel and do shows and figure out other other audibles for myself.
But.
When you are like, these aren't just balance sheet conversations.
Right, right.
You have a big staff at Have I Got News for you.
Yeah, it's very similar to Daily Show.
It's almost it's almost 100.
I think we're at like probably 70 because we're not a day.
We're not on every day.
But I know a Daily Show.
It was over 100 people that work in a building and you're trying to decide what to do next.
And then you get a job offer, God forbid, to go join another show.
And then you don't know when that show, whether or not you go do that show, this show isn't going to happen.
What would be your solution to this?
I mean, besides not merger after merger, because everyone has to, you know, pee on everything.
Like I said, cancel all the shows, even if they're good.
Cancel them if they're doing well.
It doesn't really, it has no rhyme or reason, is what you're saying.
Yeah, it definitely has no rhyme or reason.
I think that a lot of this is, if you want me to, I guess I kind of am like Scott.
I'm a bit of a fatalist.
in a way, in that the world is rotten and these corporations run most everything.
And even if you have a hit show, they're not going to let you go past three seasons, maybe five, because they have to pay you more.
And it's easier to just start a new show for this.
I personally would rather see this resolved sooner than later if the merger does not happen and we are at the same spot next June.
I think it gets stripped down and sold for parts, you know, piecemeal, you know, all over the sphere.
But you're still going to be sold into the hands of people that are being counted and cutting corners and trying to do as much as possible with as much less as possible.
I think that's true.
I think that's their threat.
Of course, we'll move out of California.
They have all these sort of boneheaded threats.
But that's the inevitability.
OK, you're going to move it.
We're going to move Paramount to Nashville.
OK.
And then you're still going to make.
20% less shows.
I forget what the number is.
What are we?
50% less scripted content than eight years ago or something.
So it's not like you're guaranteeing jobs on the other side of this.
You're just punishing people who you already, half of whom you are already going to be trying to figure out a way to fire, even if you didn't leave the state.
That's right.
That's right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So it's easier to be independent, hence why I'm independent, Roy.
But it's really, You know, I'm not loving these boneheaded moves and threats.
I think, you know, when billionaires threaten you, it's sort of it's not it's not the most attractive.
They look villainous, actually, in that regard.
And it's and it's not going to get any better because when you look at what YouTube has done and I haven't had a chance to look at the exact specifics of it.
But I know that they're changing the terms of service with their creators in terms of what the what the floor, the bar to achieve monetization at YouTube is going.
Shot up to something, I'm not going to say astronomically, but you're going to have to be really all in to try and go independent now.
So a lot of these networks are going to move the bar when it comes to monetization and making money.
The same thing with analytics on Facebook and Instagram and Reels or whatever.
So you're eventually going to be in a space where there's just going to be a chasm between.
Like this mid-major media, the Vice and the Voxes of the world, like you're going to see, Complex has had a lot of shrinkage as well.
And those were the companies where you used to be able to go if Huffington Post didn't hire you or CNN didn't run with you this year.
And I think that the idea of even being self-made is going to get even more competitive.
Harder.
It is.
No question.
No question.
I mean, I think the issue is that they, The way they're playing this seems so juvenile.
I just am like, there's ways to fix this.
You know, it's interesting that Bonta just dumped it after leaking.
I will say Paramount leaks a lot.
Bonta does not, having tried to get leaks out of Bonta.
And I'm good at getting leaks out of people.
Paramount doesn't stop.
Different people who represent them, who purport to represent them, are very easy.
They're big leakers and they think they're very clever about it.
And so I don't know if dumping a settlement talks over this is, you know, it's interesting.
It's definitely a power play by Bonta, who I think is probably, you know, he's doing the meta trial, he's doing this, and he's winning here in this case, at least, because he got the trial moved.
So why should he put up with this shit, I guess?
I think the leak shows that Paramount is for sure concerned.
And they definitely...
You don't make a play like that if you're winning.
Yeah, you don't.
You keep your mouth shut.
Or if you think you're in control of the board.
What do you think about the different unions?
The WGA is against it.
Certain writers are against it.
The directors were for it with a certain amount of demands that were pretty heavy.
Karen Bass went for it or just went for a settlement.
She's worried about Los Angeles.
Gavin Newsom always plays the metal, essentially.
Where would you like this to end up?
as someone who's a writer and a performer?
In a perfect world, no merger with production staying in Los Angeles to some degree.
I do think that Los Angeles has just infrastructure and weather advantages with production.
And I say that as someone who fought to shoot a sitcom in Atlanta and Alabama.
Like having known what the challenges are, you know, in some other places, I do think that...
If Hollywood is strong, I think entertainment across the board is strong, which then spills out to all of these other markets, be it your Louisiana with their incentives, which are starting to, they're starting to tweak theirs as well.
You know, I think that's always been the dangerous thing about tax incentives.
in other states outside of Los Angeles.
I feel like LA has always had the most consistent relationship with the entertainment industry.
When you look at what Detroit had 20 years ago, where they were making television and movies in Detroit, left and right, left and right.
Detroit called a new governor and he was like, yeah, yeah, no, no more incentive, sorry.
And that happens often.
Same thing happened in North Carolina.
So this idea of decentralizing.
television production, I think would just make it just blobulous.
Blobulous.
Every 10 years, is it amalgamate?
I don't know.
No, I like blobulous.
It works for me.
It's blobulous where every 10 years, this region's going to be the hot region.
I'm old enough and been in entertainment long enough to remember when North Carolina was the place to shoot in the late night.
Was it Dawson's Creek and a couple of Martin Lawrence movies?
It moves around.
Atlanta has seen a regression in production because the big dog Marvel took everything to Europe.
So there's just not as much stuff happening.
And that's where I do think the indie market is going to be able to help some of the smaller cities outside of L.A.
But in a perfect world for me, L.A., I think L.A.
and New York.
Carrying a ton of production is ultimately healthier for the entertainment industry coast to coast.
I think you're 100 percent right.
And it's not me hating on Texas and New Mexico.
It's all great stuff.
But those are all states that are very like which way the wind blows this election.
You might lose your incentive.
Or they're there because the governors are friendly to them.
And that's not always good.
You're right, it switches.
Also, just go look at some of the state laws in Tennessee, everybody who's thinking of moving to Nashville.
It's not great for women.
It's not thrilling for people of color.
As an Alabamian, I will.
I will abstain from these criticisms.
Okay, all right.
In any case.
No, you're right, though.
You're right.
It's just like California should get it together and they should settle this thing.
But I'm not so sure this deal is going to happen.
We'll see.
Hopefully they'll figure something out that's fair.
And the Ellison's, the only thing that drives me crazy, the Ellison's complaining about politics when they use politics to get where they are.
So far with the government, with the federal government.
It's like, stop, stop, stop, stop.
Anyway, let's go on a quick break.
When we come back, Trump's stock trading grift.
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Roy, we're back.
Griftwatch alert.
Donald Trump made more than a thousand stock trades in June with transactions totaling between $78 million and $263 million, according to his latest financial disclosure.
Notably, Trump bought between $15,000 and $50,000 worth of SpaceX stock just 11 days after the company's IPO.
And the Iran war continues.
Trump is buying and selling shares of defense contractor Palantir.
But nothing to worry about here.
The White House says there's no conflicts of interest because Trump's investments are independently managed.
Now, he has other graphs like cryptocurrency, as you know.
So this is the second shoe to drop in that regard.
He made billions in cryptocurrency already.
So how do you rank them among his graphs?
Well, the interesting thing about this whole stock thing was that the White House said that oh, it's a computer algorithm that runs the trading based on the traditional trading trends and data, data, data.
But they can't tell you who greenlit the particular trades.
They go, oh, it's a computer.
But somebody has to go, yes, computer, I approve.
Do that.
Did that person have insider information?
I think that's the thing that at this point, nothing would surprise me.
And they were so.
beaten down with political scandals that the scandals just feel like, yeah, all right.
Yeah, he made more money.
All right.
Oddly, the one trade that he made, President Trump, that I was curious about was Home Depot.
I'm like, what do you know?
You know, like, okay, grifting SpaceX and AI.
All right.
What's going on with Home Depot, man?
What do you know?
Home Depot.
Well, you know, the guy who was the chairman was super conservative.
That might just be it.
It's a conservative company.
Yeah.
Yeah, you're right.
What's going on?
What do you think is happening with you?
I don't know.
And where are we building these houses?
Would there be some destruction that you're planning?
I don't know.
I don't want to get into my conspiracy land with you.
Oh, I like it.
But that was the one that was a bigger red flag than most of the other companies.
Do you think he's ever been in a Home Depot?
No.
No.
Because he would have told you.
If Trump ever built some shit in his life, he would have said it nonstop.
He builds everything.
Right.
He was a builder.
He just said that.
Are you offended by his scripts or just exhausted by them?
I'm past offended.
I feel bad that I am not, that I'm desensitized in a way that speaks to just how exhausting so much of the scandals are.
That is a really good point.
Would there be a grift you could do that you'd be like, okay, that's the end of it.
That is it.
That is it.
I think sports betting would be one that would lose him favor with his base.
which sounds crazy, but there's something about the understood purity and sanctity of sport that if you found out that he knew.
the lineup card for a particular and this guy wasn't going to start.
And, you know, like fan like the weird fantasy football.
Black Sox.
Yeah.
Black Sox type throw the game.
Please strike out like the scandals that MLB is dealing with right now, where the pitchers are betting on themselves to not throw a strike on the first pitch and then they deliberately don't throw a strike.
Like if Trump was in on something like that, maybe that would be one.
Because sports is so American and it's pure and you're supposed to be honest and you're supposed to do it the right way.
Now you're giving him an idea of where to go next.
That's the thing.
Some stock in FanDuel right now.
I go Home Depot.
Go to Home Depot.
So speaking of things that they're doing that exhaust me as a journalist, Pentagon has fired three top staffers at Stars and Stripes, a government-funded news outlet that reports in the U.S.
military.
The Pentagon cited insubordination as the reason for the firings.
Two of the staffers had recently spoken publicly about protecting the paper's editorial independence, which it has had for...
forever, pointing to the legal right to be free from news management and censorship.
The third has already announced his retirement, citing fundamental disagreements over the paper's values and mission.
The fire has come as Defense Secretary Pete Hegsest pushes to reshape the paper with more focus on war fighting and less on woke distractions.
If Hegsest is making editorial decisions here, what kind of stories will we see now?
I don't know what we're going to see.
What war, what propaganda do you want?
Like, they won't print what we need to print the right way.
And good.
for those journalists for having a little bit of backbone and some teeth about themselves.
Yeah, Sergeant Stripes has a pretty good reputation among the military.
I have a lot of family in the military.
And it actually is considered not, I mean, no Defense Department official has tried to do this.
Like, it is run relatively independently.
Obviously, it's funded by the Pentagon, but they've never tried to meddle in it before.
I mean, and what they were writing about was the conditions on the USS Lincoln.
And they didn't like that.
They didn't like.
Stars and stripes pointing out that it's a mess.
Which it is.
The carrier's been out way too long.
They're undersupplied.
Everything's backing up and they're expected to.
So yeah, you have, it's probably one of the best ways you could ever honor the military.
I think the problem now is for the journalists that are going to be hired and put in there now.
Like this is, this is one of those cases where you almost support AI reporting.
Like just.
Just print up what you want, bro.
Just print up.
Just have AI report.
Just conjure up whatever it is.
Don't involve me and my integrity in this.
I think that the Stars and Stripes issue is, that one is a little more effed up to me simply because This is a piece of journalism that goes to the people who serve this country.
And so when you're telling them what is going on within their world like that and, you know, like the, what's the AFN, like the Armed Forces Network, where you're showing them and, you know, here's the content we have decided to expose you to.
How much of that then becomes mental manipulation?
Or they don't believe it or they don't trust it.
I mean, that's, I think, the point is to hollow out trust, right?
If it's done a pretty good job covering your life, and it's not like, it's not going to do like Washington Post-like investigative pieces necessarily, but it's accurate about your life and not able to talk about a ship that is in trouble.
And you would think the rank and file aren't going to realize that, Hexf?
They do not.
At some point, then you start having morale issues.
Yeah, well, I think he's having them.
I think he's not going to be.
It's terrible.
You know, I understand lying to the American people, but lying to the people that protect the American people, that's just even more egregious.
Don't you want more war fighting, right?
More war fighting and not woke distractions.
Because, you know, wars win elections, they say, right?
No, not this one.
Not this one.
All right, let's go on a quick break.
When we come back, we'll check on Trump's personal relationships.
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Roy, we're back with more news.
Now is the time to talk about some updates in Trump's personal relationships.
Admits ongoing speculation about Trump and his aide, Natalie Hart, Melania Trump made her first public appearance in more than a month.
Let's listen to the entrance she made.
Good afternoon.
I heard you missed me.
Here I am.
Roy, did you miss Melania?
No.
And then moving on, let me just say the president and his former fixer, Michael Cohen, have publicly reconciled sitting down for their first interview together since Cohen became a key witness in Trump's hush money trial.
The reunion is quite a reversal after years of public attacks.
Cohen has called Trump a con man and a predator and Trump called Cohen a rat.
In definitely totally unrelated news, Cohen has submitted a pardon application to the Trump administration.
And of course, amid...
questions about his health from bruising his hands to the troubles, staying awake.
Doctors are also raising concern about his weight since he gained about 20 pounds.
This is his relationship with his self.
Since the 2024 campaign, doctors told the Washington Post that Trump's weight is a strong risk factor for premature disability and death.
So, so many things.
And then, of course, Natalie Harp, who more and more comes out, the more and more disturbing it seems to be, including old tweets.
She seems to have...
a real strange obsession on him.
A lot of the right is trying to argue that she's the true feminist, but I don't think that's the definition of a feminist.
So any of these things you'd like to weigh in on, Roy?
First off, first and foremost, just to everybody, just stop getting excited about bad Trump health news.
Yeah.
It's just not, I had this evil ass teacher in the fifth grade.
She's still alive.
Yeah.
Like.
You don't understand.
When you make all the wrong moves in life, it gives you vibrance.
Yeah, yeah, it does.
You can just defy sickness and death and bad luck because you just got to put bad decisions on top of bad decisions.
And that's what the president has shown an ability to do.
My grandmother used to say, let me tell you, when someone who was bad wouldn't die, she'd always go, God doesn't want them.
Well, check with the devil.
Why is it all about God?
The hand pictures are just funny to me because just the camera, the quality of cameras now, you can get in and see the literal makeup line around the knuckles.
Right, and the liver spots, yeah.
Okay, all right.
The Cohen interview is very funny.
Tell me about that.
It's very funny.
And it's softcore porn level of glazing.
I will just leave it at that.
That Cohen is juggling them.
Just juggling them.
Yeah, yeah.
He calls him.
We don't have to get into any specific thing that they talked about because it's all just lobbing softballs for Trump to say.
Like the first two minutes is why won't the left media report on how good you're doing?
And then he goes bash the left and polls.
Why are they still?
Now, actually, I did agree with Cohen on this.
Why are we still focusing on presidential approval ratings for a man who cannot run again?
I understand approval ratings being common chit chat or whatever, but just in a bigger scheme of what I need to know today, I don't need to know how many people love or hate him to people who love him.
Well, it could be because how Republicans are going to fare because he's a drag on them, possibly.
That's fair.
OK, so if you use them polls as, you know, to prognosticate for November.
OK, cool.
But.
There's a matter of fact, I marked it.
It's at 1230 for the people who want to go check out the interview at 1230.
Cohen says along the lines and I and I loosely quote, hey, boss, do you remember that time we were working together and I was sitting alongside you?
And like just that sentence, it just sounds like a child reconnecting with his father.
And he just wants to be liked and approved by this man so bad that he does not.
care that he called him a rat.
Like, he called you a rat.
That's like, that's up there.
Yeah.
Yeah, a rat is a big move.
The whole interview is like 15, 20 minutes of just kiss ass and Trump just hitting softballs out the park like he always does.
Didn't even have the decency to turn the camera on.
Yeah, I didn't have, you know, Cohen was on a lot of cable and I was always like, I think he's a rat.
Like, I don't know why we're listening to him insult him.
So I thought he was lying then.
I think he's lying now.
I think ultimately he was the...
The person you saw in that interview was Imsequious Toady, who is desperate to get a pardon.
That kind of fills it up for me.
May I ask you a question?
Sure.
About Melania?
Who do you think misses her more or draws attention to her absence?
Who do you think cares more about her absence?
Liberals or conservatives?
Liberals.
I wonder what are the expectations?
And we we have the expectations of of a first lady to be active and working in conjunction with the president's agenda.
You know, they're the more forward facing customer service arm of the White House to go out and touch the people on a regular basis.
Do does anybody want Melania showing up?
No.
I don't really care.
I agree with you.
That's what I mean.
She's a strange mannequin.
I find her to be mannequin-like, you know, high fashion, kind of, that sort of sharp.
mannequin-like look.
But high fashion's not Americana.
No, it's not.
Barbara Bush looked like she baked cookies.
And she did not.
Come on by the house, Barbara.
I think the first lady thing, people are all mad she's not there.
I don't think we should be paying for her.
I don't really care if we have a first lady or not.
I think that's an anachronism, honestly, in this day and age, ultimately.
So I don't really care that she's not there.
I think she's charmless.
I think she's...
unpleasant for the most part.
And the more you see of her, the less you want to see of her, right?
So I'm glad she's gone kind of stuff.
Charmless.
Charmless.
You know what I mean?
She's charmless.
I had a conversation with Trevor Noah years ago about how we always felt like Melania missed the mark in that she could have played the being absent to be on some pro-feminism tip where you just go, I don't...
That's his job.
It's not my job to do stuff that helps his job as a woman.
I am allowed to be woman over here.
Why do I have to be woman right here?
But she just never played it like that.
Yeah, she didn't play it like that.
She also doesn't really have a job, does she?
I don't really feel a plus with her, and I think it's a minus for her to be around.
So in Melania's defense, Melania didn't want none of that shit.
She doesn't.
Melania thought she was going to marry a rich dude who was sitting in the corner and eat McDonald's while she go spends his money and bang yacht bros in Monaco on the side.
And then you come home and he's talking about, I'm going to be president because Seth Meyers pissed me off.
What?
Yeah.
That wasn't the deal, Donald.
No, Donald.
I just find her to be charmless.
I'm happy she's gone.
I do think this, I think she gets paid every time she shows up.
It looks like it because she pops up.
I think she's not unfunny and everything.
And the less the see of her, the better.
That's my feeling.
But this Natalie Harp thing adds an entirely interesting wrinkle to it.
And I think it's completely appropriate to talk about that.
I think a lot of people don't think that, but I do because she's right next to the...
president doing his tweets all night long.
So to me, she's completely fine to talk about.
I don't know how you feel about her.
Have you never written a long ass apology to your boss?
You've never apologized to your boss?
Oh my God, I hope I didn't embarrass you by walking around too much on the golf course while you were walking because you were the greatest.
I can't imagine Roy Wood Jr.
has ever done that.
There are some women in media who if I worked for, I would absolutely be like, I am so sorry, please.
But it would not be from some trying to holler.
Can I ask a nasty question?
Sure, please.
Go ahead.
When are you even going to bang him?
He sleeps all the time.
I don't think they're doing that.
I know, but like.
It's something else.
It's something else.
It's like a daddy thing.
I think it's a daddy thing.
It's.
Odd.
It's vaguely sexual, but it's not.
It's something else.
I don't know.
It all eventually turns sexual at some point, I think.
Probably true.
But here's what I feel like.
Years ago, Elon Musk was insisting we live in a simulation.
You know, this idea that none of this, you and I aren't real, everything is fake.
I think we're in a simulation at this point.
After the Natalie Harp thing, after I read that letter, I'm like, there is an alien teenager playing this fucking video game of Earth.
Earth is the video game.
Some advanced civilization, and they just inserted Natalie Harp into it.
I just decided.
Now I agree with Elon Musk.
Just a random fool character.
Yeah, just like.
This person.
I'm like, it has to be.
Come on.
Come on.
You couldn't write this.
Would you be able to write this?
It's weird.
I mean, there's tropes from Fatal Attraction.
There's tropes from, none of them end well.
None of these stalkery tropes end well for the man, usually.
Well, or his adjacent people around him.
I mean, but at least Trump's got Secret Service.
He can just get her out of here.
Yeah, yeah.
No, he seems to like her a lot.
I like there was one part of that.
They had the cars on the mall down in Washington.
Again, I didn't mind the car thing.
Fine.
If he wants to have a race course.
But Melania was there for four seconds, gets up.
And the minute Melania moved out of the picture, Natalie came in the back.
It was really interesting.
And a real first lady would have cared.
That's how you know that marriage is vapid.
Because Melania would have been like, y'all better get her the hell out of here.
She'd have been down on the track changing tires.
messing around with a real first lady.
Hillary would have taken her apart.
Hillary.
She would be an aide for a city council person in Paducah, Kentucky.
And that's with respect to Paducah.
I swear you're right.
She would have been gone.
She would be gone.
Keep going further.
Guam.
She'd have been in Guam.
Guam is...
I'm not going to say the show, but there are a couple of your favorite shows that you watch where there's an employee that they don't like.
They give them a glowing recommendation to another show, usually in another city.
And then they get the job offer and they go, hey, I got to quit.
I'm happy for you, though.
We don't hate to see you go.
I have done that.
I haven't done that exactly.
I've done a version of that.
I had someone who I really wanted to fire.
And he goes, he comes in and I was, and he goes on, he goes, what I really think I need is a raise.
And I said, oh, God, see, I wanted to fire you.
So it's kind of interesting that I, well, I think I deserve a raise.
And I said, I think you deserve to be fired.
It's so hard for me to, like, decide which one of these things to do.
And I've done a version of that with many different employees.
Like I said, when they have job offers, I'm like, you should, that's fantastic.
That's good.
Good.
Excellent.
Excellent.
Yeah.
I actually, when anyone ever leaves my employer, I'm happy that they're doing something.
If people want to go, they should go.
If they don't, that's always been my problem.
I never get mad or anything else.
I don't know.
I just like it for you.
I'm fine with the IndyCars, too.
I was fine with the UFC.
Just take the cage down.
I hear it's still up.
Is it?
No, I don't think so.
Like, it's just sitting there.
If not, it was full up.
No, I'm not sure.
I think they put the helipad there now.
Oh, thank goodness.
This really ugly helipad that he signed.
Yeah, I know.
He's putting his name on it.
There's also the gold horses, which I have to see every time I come back from the airport.
Anyway, we'll see what happens.
All right, Roy, one more quick break.
We'll be back for wins and fails.
Okay, Roy, let's hear some wins and fails.
You go first.
Shout out to Karen Atiyah at the Washington Post.
That was gonna be one of mine, but I have several, but go ahead, say why.
That's my only one.
This woman unjustly fired for giving her opinion about part of, it wasn't even about what happened to Charlie Kirk.
It was about whether or not we should honor Charlie Kirk.
was fired immediately from the Washington, but you know, the whole op-ed section there, they've been trying to kind of, hey, everybody quiet down those opinions.
You're making Bezos, Matt.
And she fought, she fought, she took it to arbitration.
And this week they gave her her job back.
The arbitrator decided, hey, you were not, that's not how you fire.
go back to work immediately, and here's your back pay.
I love Karen.
I think Karen's a badass.
She also does like, I love all her photos.
I love how she puts it.
What's really fantastic and ironic, the guy who fired her is gone.
That young moron they hired in her place.
I love Karen.
You're right, 100%.
I don't know if she'll stay, but good for her.
You're right, 100%.
I personally, and this is speaking to someone who does not know her.
Based on the readings of her work, she strikes me as someone who would stay, just if nothing else, to throw a last couple of real ass articles in that publication that's suppressing a lot of the type of work that she does so well.
Yeah, I would agree.
Yeah.
I'm going to talk to her today.
I'll find out.
I was going to reach out to her because I'm sure she's...
Celebrating.
She's been doing actually interesting courses herself.
She's a bit of an entrepreneur and has been doing sort of a bunch of interesting things.
But that was just ridiculous.
And I love that she fought.
She almost took the buyout and then didn't, which was interesting.
And she's like, no, I'm going to stay here.
I'm going to stay here.
do my work.
And they immediately, and I said, Karen, I think they're going to fire you then.
And that's what they did.
And the way they did it was so fucking ridiculous, but she stood her ground.
You're right.
All right.
What is your fail?
My fail is, is, is me.
No one told me that you needed a friend to take you home for a colonoscopy.
I scheduled a colonoscopy and I'm trying to be all reverent about my health and the heart and the blood sugar.
And I set the date and then they call me two weeks before and they go, yeah, you need a friend.
And I don't.
Like, you start thinking about like, now we're getting into emergency contact level friendship.
And I just, and I realized with the people that I have, with the alliances and the associates that I've made in 11 years in New York City, I don't really have anyone to the level, few comedians.
Yeah, I don't have colonoscopy where you take me home after a camera.
Probe level friends.
And I had to reschedule my colonoscopy.
I found a person, but I have to reschedule the colonoscopy.
There's no other availability until November.
Oh no.
So I had to wait two months to go back because I just, I don't know.
I was in a big health kick.
I go through like, I call it like health week, like every August or September, I do everything.
Yeah.
Scheduled a first colonoscopy.
You never had one?
No, you never had one.
How old are you?
I'm sure I should have had it sooner.
I'm 47.
You're okay.
So I probably is overdue.
I don't know.
I've done the prostate, and apparently that's now blood.
It is.
It's amazing.
Okay, well, I was in there demanding the finger.
Got odd.
Well, you'll enjoy the colonoscopy, I can tell you.
I've had many.
I love them.
I just say I enjoy them.
Katie Couric, who is the big colonoscopy pusher among people I know, because her husband did die of colon cancer.
I love it because, one, it cleans you out.
You feel great.
You used to have to drink all these milkshakes, but now you don't.
Water.
There's like water, kind of jelly water.
Now it's just a pill.
Now it's just a pill.
And that's great because the drinking stuff is awful.
But I feel great.
That was the other thing that I was scared.
You were like, yeah, you've got to take a dump for a day and a half.
It is.
Stay home.
Stay close to home.
This is all I have to say to you.
It's shocking.
You're like, how bad could it be?
And then you're like, wow, I have a lot of shit in there, so to speak.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I feel myself trying to take care of my health and realize I need better friends.
But you need a bit.
I will come to pick you up at your colonoscopy anytime.
Thank you.
I will come to New York to pick you up.
I'll get Kirk to do it.
Katie Kirk will do it.
She'll pick you up.
She loves people getting colonoscopies.
Well, good for you.
Well, that's good for you to admit.
All right, I'm going to do mine.
I have to.
You know, you're a comic.
Rosie O'Donnell guest hosting Jimmy Come Alive.
She did a fantastic job.
I know you've done different guest hosting things, but I thought she has.
come back in a really nice way and obviously was always right about Trump.
But the fact that she underplayed Trump quite a bit, except that last bit, was fantastic.
She did a whole different kind of show than Kimmel, which I thought was a good idea.
She did the show that...
fit her.
It wasn't really a late night show.
It was sort of more of an afternoon show, but I really appreciated that she landed and did very well.
The ratings did really well.
I've always had a lot of respect for Rosie O'Donnell, you know, and people forget that, you know, she was a beast of a standup and actress and improv and, you know, did daytime, did the view.
So she literally has the duality of the chops needed to do exactly everything that you just said and still just damn likable.
Likeable.
She really has.
I think going to Ireland has been good for her.
She's a great singer.
I had an interview with her.
She sang on my show.
I thought it was just what people needed in terms of feeling.
And again, I would say she deserved all the kudos she's gotten.
The negative is this guy, I don't even know, the tall guy who has to call attention to himself about with the dildos and everything else, all these men that do this.
The problem with women's basketball is asshole straight men.
just can't just stop attacking these women.
I think it's misogynist.
I think it's racist for sure.
I think it's, you know, I don't really care if Sophie Cunningham says things about trans people.
Fine.
Like, fine.
She has her opinions.
But the fact that these men are coming in there and ruining the game for everybody, just they should be tossed out of the stadiums.
And that's the end of it.
Well, it's not.
I think it's more important to say specifically it's right wing men in the media.
Yes, exactly.
They're doing it to bring attention.
And it's not just the person that I don't feel like naming.
There's a couple of them.
And it's one of the same ones that declared themselves eligible for the WNBA draft next year.
Yes, that's Ennis, right?
Ennis?
Yeah, yeah, Cantor.
Yeah.
And who's the same one who was escorted out of the game the other night for jaw jacking with a Chicago Sky player.
during the game.
I thought she could have killed him.
I thought she could have killed him if she had a chance myself.
There's something wild to showing up to a game to deliberately get kicked, to start mess so that you can then go talk about it so you can then monetize the clicks.
Yep, agreed.
That's what it's all.
I would agree.
He's grotesque.
He's a grotesque and he's a washed up.
player at this point from what I can tell.
This is all he's got.
Even if you feel that way about this issue in the WNBA, go to the commissioner's office.
Yeah, exactly.
That's where you really want to change the policy.
Go there.
Yeah, I agree.
Anyway, we want to hear from you.
Send us your questions about business, tech, or whatever's on your mind.
Go to nymag.com slash pivot to submit a question for the show or call 855-511-8255.
Pivot.
And elsewhere in the Karen Scott universe, this week on On with Kara Swisher, I'm talking to one of the newest members of the Vox Media Podcast Network family, Ina Garten.
Her show, Happy Hour with Ina Garten, launches next month.
Let's listen to a clip.
When I think about my brand, I always think the first thing is fun.
If it's fun, people will be really attracted to it.
From the store, like when you walked into the store, all of your senses were engaged.
And I love that when people walked in.
they felt good.
And they would say, I just came in to see what was going on, and then they'd walk out with three bags of groceries.
And I would think, yeah, did my job today.
And I feel that way about the television.
If it's fun, people will really be attracted to it.
So that's kind of where I'm always looking.
Anyway, I love Ina.
I think she's great.
She does a great job.
You should go on that show and have cocktails with her.
I'm happy to.
Would love it.
That would be a really interesting conversation.
Anyway, she's great.
Okay, that's the show.
Thanks so much, Roy.
You've been amazing.
And I'm very excited to come on your show.
Season 5 of Have I Got News For You premieres on September 12th on CNN.
I forget which one, but I'm pretty early in the season.
Put me on with whoever you want.
I'm happy to...
spark with them.
Where else can people find you, Roy?
What else are you up to?
I'm going to get you online.
I'm going to get you on there with Mom Donnie.
Mom Donnie.
Perfect.
All right.
So where else can people find you?
What else are you up to?
My name is Roy Wood Jr.
Put a dot com behind it.
Put an at symbol in front.
That's everywhere.
Outside of CNN, I'll be on a new Amazon sitcom barbershop based on the hit movie franchise.
That's not out until later this year or top of next year.
They haven't given us a...
premiere date yet, but that'll be the next thing after.
How many are there?
There's three or four, right?
There's three barbershops and then there's the beauty shop spinoff with Queen.
Beauty shop.
I love the beauty shop.
Oh my God.
That is my merger insurance.
So you make sure you watch that when it comes out.
Are you kidding?
I'm a big barbershop fan.
I didn't know.
I had no idea.
I'm so excited.
Who are you playing?
It's a good time.
I play like a younger Sid the Entertainer type, if you will.
Not Sid's character.
Nobody can do that.
But I represent the, I'm the most senior person in the shop.
So it's definitely a more youthful series that just follows the continuation of how Chicago has evolved and how barbershop culture has changed with the modernization and appointment culture and all of that stuff.
I'm so excited.
I love beauty shop, I'll be honest with you.
I love it too.
I like all the shops.
Anyway, thanks for listening to Pivot and be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel.
We'll be back on Friday.
Again, Roy, thank you very much and I can't wait to see you.
Thank you, Fred.
Good to see you.
Today's show was produced by Lara Neiman, Zoe Marcus, Taylor Griffin.
And Todd Wiseman, Ernie Enderdot engineered this episode.
Thanks also to Kate Gallagher.
Nishat Kerwa is Vox Media's executive producer of podcasts.
Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform.
Thanks for listening to Pivot from Vox Media.
We'll be back later this week for another breakdown of all things tech and business.
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