# Anthropic's Strategic Pivot and Market Implications

**Podcast:** Pivot
**Published:** 2026-03-06

## Transcript

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When you think of someone with ADHD, who comes to mind?
Is it a woman in her 30s?
Just this constant feeling of being too much, you know, too kinetic, too loud, all the too anything, and just really feeling like people got some kind of social rule book that I never got.
The changing face of ADHD.
That's the most important person, and yet he's not.
New episodes, everyone.
This is Pivot from New York magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network.
I'm Kara Swisher.
I'm Scott Galloway.
And where are you, Scott?
Uh, somewhere over the North Atlantic, Kara, where are you?
All right, I am in my studio in DC.
But we we recorded.
Corey, maintain eye contact.
Maintain eye contact.
Is Corey Lewandowski with you?
So I'm fairly certain he's not gonna keep his job either.
I'm guessing.
Well, let me just give people back it up for a minute.
Scott, we recorded earlier, but had to hop back on, hence why you're on a plane and I'm and we're redoing this.
President Trump has fired Homeland Security Secretary Christy Nomer, giving her a fake job.
Trump announced the move on true social, saying Gnome had served us well and had has had numerous and spectacular results.
He announced the Republican Senator Mark Wayne Mullen would replace Gnome.
Gnome is stepping into a new role, apparently.
She wasn't quite fired.
I don't know what this is.
It's like a firing.
Oh no, she was fired.
I get it.
It's like special envoy to Hulu original programming or something.
She's special envoy.
Let's get it right.
Special envoy to the Shield of the Americas.
I I don't even know.
That's like a bad Marvel movie, I feel like.
Like the one that we don't want to watch.
But let's talk about this, because uh later in the show, you have uh we will be talking about a lot of things happening right now for the Republicans.
But um talk to me about this firing a little bit.
Well, supposedly, I mean, you might have more information than me, is it because supposedly it wasn't the conflict of interests uh having an affair with their number two.
It wasn't uh uh essentially killing American citizens.
It wasn't, it wasn't essentially overseeing what I would argue are the definition of concentration camps, and that was black sites outside the legal jurisdiction of protection of your origin country, which is the definition of a concentration camp.
It was supposedly what was the straw that broke Trump's back, was that she had spent close to or over 200 million dollars, I believe, on ads featuring her, which appeared to be uh courtesy of her for number two, an attempt to raise her awareness for a presidential run.
That that was what angered Trump.
What have you heard, Kara?
She was advantaging herself, and Trump likes to only advantage himself, right?
And so anybody else who's trying to do that.
There was also the question, these two recent congressional hearings.
To me, I I felt the writing was on the wall because Republicans in the Senate particularly were really going after her.
So they knew that they had no repercussions to do so, right?
If they had gone after her because they were good people or because they had a a backbone, I think only Tom Tillis has been doing that because he's leaving.
Um this is Senator Tillis from North Carolina.
I think she uh I think they had permission to go after her, whether it was uh uh Kennedy, uh John Kennedy or uh or others that really did attack her.
Um, and the Democrats did an excellent job too, bringing up all these issues you talked about.
I just felt like it was open season on her, so to speak, someone who enjoys killing dogs.
And you know, even the reaction has been interesting.
Uh Senator Tom Tillis, uh, who was very upset about the disaster relief fuck-ups, I think, very much so, and about also about uh going after people who didn't commit any crimes, right?
Just in terms of uh he kept talking about a quota system.
Why are you doing it on a quota system in the in these hearings?
He his uh his thing on X saying goodbye was Senator Mark Wayne Mullen is a great guy and a great choice to lead DHS, restore competence, and refocus efforts on quickly distributing disaster aid.
That's the first thing he noted, keeping the border secure and targeting violent illegal immigrants for deportation.
Another big positive, he likes dogs, um, which of course is referenced to uh her her killing uh her dog.
Um, people are having a field day about this, of course, uh on the thing.
Although one of the good ones about Mark Wayne Mullen, who is a senator from Oklahoma, was uh he can't even have a border between his name, uh Mark and Wayne, Mark Wayne.
Um, but no, they you know, people the Republicans felt emboldened to attack her, and therefore it was very clear that they got their signals from the White House, would be my guess.
Okay, but that just goes to what a poor manager and what a low character person, or spoiler alert, for president is, and that is when you hire people and you expect them to be part of a team.
If you know you're gonna fire them, which it sounds like he did because it took about three seconds.
The moment they announced she was leaving, they announced her replacement.
To quite frankly trot her out and use her as an anger pillow and humiliate her before showing her the door, knowing that you were gonna fire her, as opposed to saying, look, we're making a change.
There's no reason for you to go in front of Congress, or once you resign, you probably will not be called.
Maybe maybe they still would have called her in front of Congress.
Yeah, that last two days in Congress was bad.
But that was okay, we have absolutely no respect, fidelity, camaraderie for the people I hire.
And if it serves my political purposes, I will throw them under the bus and then back up the bus and run over them again.
That's the Trump way, right?
That's the Trump way.
And in fact, he doesn't even give her the I don't think she deserves any dignity.
The dignity of just firing her, like you're fired.
I mean, the guy who's so famous for doing you're fired cannot say you're fired.
You have to give him this shabestial envoy to the shield of the Americas, which, and of course, she's bragging as if she won, right?
As if it was a good thing, because uh like even as she's humiliated, and by the next humiliation, by the way, is gonna be Pam Bondi, right?
That's obvious.
He's gonna go, all the ladies, as uh, you know, of the Trump administration are in big trouble.
Um, and they will be the first to go.
They'll get to Cash Patel at some point, or maybe not, but like another incompetent, another, you know, same thing with Pam Bondy, mendacious and incompetent.
Um, and so it he doesn't he the fact that he hasn't let go so many of these people already who are just not up to the task is really says a ton about his management style.
I think they're more strategic than people want to give me a credit for.
And when I was a consultant, I always used to say I would review decks and associates going in to present to a management team, I would say, I would ask a series of questions.
And one of the questions I would ask, but I would say I would ask, who's in the room that's not in the room?
And that is what is the context, what is the influences, what is the overarching thing of the vibe in this room or their objectives before you even show up.
And the two people that are always in the room around any Trump official and any public activity are one, Roy Cohn.
If you look at the way these people equip themselves in front of the Senate and the Congress, one of the greatest erosions in the grand equity of the United States is there has always been a level of civility and decorum.
They aren't that South Korean Senate where they break into fisticuffs or they start yelling at each other.
There was always a certain amount of respect.
But this Roy Cohn deny, deflect, attack, obfuscate, attack.
You're you're a you're you're you should be ashamed of yourself.
You're a failed lawyer.
Go on, don't answer the question.
That has in and among itself eroded the value and the prestige of the Senate.
Roy Cohn is always in the room when these guys testify.
The person that's always in the room is Epstein.
And I believe there are three people armed with LLM saying monitoring the temperature of Epstein in the news, and when it gets above a certain temperature, they think of distractions.
And nothing is better than one of these hearings or declaring war or saying you're gonna raise tariffs of 50%.
But I literally think they have they are monitoring the number of times Epstein and Trump are linked together when it gets above a certain temperature in the press.
I think you're right.
They they they throw someone under the bus, announce the tariff, start start firing missiles, whatever it might be, you know, uh capturing or uh absconding with with um leaders of Central American countries.
But Roy Cohn and Jeffrey Epstein are in every room.
I that's really smart.
That's a uh and the Epstein stuff is not going away.
Let me just say it is not, it is as I said a half a year ago, it is n it is here to stay.
Like it's the thing.
To to Christy Noam's credit, she did not go to the uh island on her fuck plane.
Um so that's a good that's a good part of her.
But we wish you well, Christy.
You're completely incompetent and deserve to be fired.
Um, but the fact that he kept you there that long says more about Donald Trump than it does about Christine Ohm.
She she's is what she is, I guess.
I heard she's gonna be volunteering at an all-kill dog shelter.
Oh, very funny.
I mean, that's gonna that's gonna go to the end of her days undeservedly so.
Anyway, uh now back to the rest of the show.
Uh guess where I went last night.
Where'd you go?
Party for uh Andrew Ross Sorkin at the French embassy, our favorite Canadian.
I was not invited.
I know.
It was my puck, and he got the First Amendment award.
He gave a he gave such a good speech.
He's like a very talented guy.
He's such a nice boy.
I don't know what else to say.
He's a nice boy.
He gave an excellent speech about the First Amendment.
And he he said everyone thinks he's Canadian, because we say that's the case.
He now is asked about his Canadian citizens.
He's a lovely man.
I like his wife too.
His wife, they're they're very good.
But let's just say he's Canadian, even though he's not a good one.
Can I tell you the first time I heard his name?
What?
Yeah.
My first board meeting at the New York Times.
Uh they were going around and we have this succession strategy, and that's when I knew the CEO wasn't very good, was it was clear she was like shooting everybody that got near the CEO spot.
And they went through and we were trying to, everyone was asking about compensation and equity awards.
And they mentioned this one young reporter, and everyone's like, well, offer them 8%.
Well, you know.
Yeah.
And they mentioned they go, oh, and we have this young reporter who's really talented, Andrew Salker.
And everyone went, Pam whatever he wants.
Oh.
Everyone literally said, you know, we're trying to manage a company that we need fiscal discipline.
It wasn't doing well.
Yeah.
And his name comes up and everyone looks around.
Pam whatever he wants.
We can't lose that guy.
Yeah.
Well, he looks great.
He gave he got the First Amendment Award.
I and he gave a beautiful speech.
Anyway, congratulations, Andrew.
Was it a fun party?
It was a good party.
Daddy's going to a big party.
What are you doing?
Well, you were invited, but you wouldn't be my plus one.
Oh, the Vanity Fair.
I actually um the guy who's the editor's boyfriend, Sean McCreesh, was there, and he sat where it's going.
I said, Well, Scott Galloway is gonna be there, so he'll shut the place.
Fuck down.
Um you want to see someone at the bar having a good time?
Yeah.
I've been so nervous about what to wear.
I spent most of the weekend trying to uh style myself, which is not easy.
Don't wear jeans at a tux like Ted Sarandos.
I didn't think that worked.
I'm rolling up to the bar and I'm getting fucked up, and I'm just gonna observe.
I don't need to speak to anybody.
No, you need to talk to people.
You know what I do.
I talked to Ted Sarandos about strategy and who we should acquire.
No, don't do these.
Do not do the executives.
There, can I tell you two quick stories in Vancouver?
I want to meet the gay hockey guys.
Will they be there?
Oh, they probably oh, I'm sure they'll be there.
Oh, I've got them there.
Yeah, meet the gay hockey guys.
Are you allowed to take selfies at that thing or do they kick you out?
Well, I don't know.
They used to.
I I can let me tell you two quick stories.
I went to one when it was up at this um, it was in that hotel, Sunset Towers.
It used to be at the Sunset Towers, and it was small, much more intimate.
And one year all the tech people got went.
Like all they invited all the tech people.
And so I was like, fuck, I don't want to see these people.
I want to see celebrities.
And they k they kept they're really shy at the time, and they kept bothering me, like to talk to me.
And I was like, I don't want to talk to you, Sergey Brynn.
I don't want to talk to you, all you people.
And Sergey Brenn wouldn't wasn't able to talk to anybody, but except they were wearing Google glass.
He was wearing a Google Glass.
And he goes, No one's talking to me.
And I'm like, take off your fucking Google Glass and like say you're a billionaire.
That's how it's gonna work here.
The second time, uh the second time we went there, I ran into um I was talking as you did, uh, to Bob Iger or uh I forget Comcast Head, may have been Ted Serrando's.
And the guy who plays uh Harry Potter came up to me and said, Excuse me, you know, he and he said, I've noticed all the really important uh studio people are sort of.
No, I did no.
Let me finish the story.
Shut up.
Okay, sorry.
So he said, I've noticed you're talking, they're all talking to you, and they're very interested in talking to you.
Who are you?
This guy was really smart.
I love him, Daniel Gradcliffe.
And I said, I'm their drug dealer.
That's what I did.
But I'm not.
Anyway, I have a lot of good stories from there.
You'll have a good time.
Talk to people.
Talk, say hello to Robert De Niro if he's there.
Because he's not my style.
I wasn't gonna go.
I said no.
And then someone we both know said, You have to go once.
So I'm gone.
You do.
But I've literally, it's been very stressful picking on my outfit.
It's early.
Remember, it's early.
You go like like 10 o'clock in the morning.
I'm literally leaving you at South by Southwest.
I'm changing on the plane and I'm going straight to the event.
I only think I was invited because they thought I was gonna be your plus one.
No.
And then you said no and I said yes.
No, I don't think so.
Anyway, uh, have a great time.
You'll have a great time.
We've got a lot to get to today because we also we're gonna be in this weekend, we'll be in Minneapolis.
We'll talk about that in a second.
On Sunday, we're very excited to do resist and unsubscribe there.
Um, but let's get to the news first.
Let's dig in.
First, uh, Defense Secretary Pete Heggseth says the war in Iran is far from over, warning that we've only just begun.
It was such a ridiculous press conference.
As a record, the House is set to vote on a measure to block President Trump from taking further action in Iran without congressional support.
And the Senate already failed to do that, by the way.
European leaders are pushing back on Trump, notably Spain's prime minister who said we can't play Russian roulette with the destiny of millions of people.
He's absolutely correct.
The White House said they were cooperating, and then they said they weren't.
Um Trump is also facing pushback from parts of his MAGA base over the war, even as he insists MAGA loves what I'm doing.
They do not love what he's doing.
And looking at the economic impact, U.S.
gas prices saw their biggest single-day spike in three years this week, and oil prices continue to rise.
I've been uh I've been talking to a lot of Republicans.
In fact, had a meeting with a very prominent one yesterday.
Um, and they are they I can tell you they do not like this.
Or they they think Pete Heggseth is is an imbecile, that's for sure.
And they don't think this was well thought out at all.
I think and that's that's the Republicans.
And these are people who maybe publicly are being supportive by at least voting against his the restrictions on Trump.
What what are your thoughts about the economy?
What's happening here?
It really hasn't taken much of a hit yet.
It's the existential threat that it could digress into something much bigger and more dangerous.
Oil is up about 11 11 bucks a barrel or 10% uh or 12%, which translates to about 25 cents a gallon.
Typically, typically wars, the markets go down and then they check back, and actually the year after a war ends, markets typically outperform.
So I don't think you can say that the markets have responded or that we know this is gonna be inflationary.
Yeah.
What I think you can say is that I believe if he had gone to Congress and made an argument for why we're doing this, why now, and what are our objectives, he might have gotten the authorization for the use of military force.
They they never get declarations of war any longer.
They get AUMFs.
But unfortunately, what they've done is because they had to position this as a defensive action, they said, oh, one of our allies was about to be imminently attacked.
We were gonna have to respond.
So it's like, okay, you just gave in to this very dangerous trope that Israel's controlling the U.S.
Yes.
That was just and you have had such inconsistent messaging.
Absolutely.
This is regime change.
No, we don't want regime change.
This is going to be five days.
We'll be there as long as it takes.
Yeah.
This is a now the Kurds.
We're bringing the Kurds in.
Yeah, now we're gonna operate the Kurds.
Well, okay, what does that mean when the Kurds get fired up in other regions?
This is a special combat operation.
No, it's a war.
They have so much inconsistent messaging, and the fact that they didn't reflect the confidence to, at a minimum, think about the American citizens in the Gulf and a plan for getting them out of that.
That seems like makes Biden's Afghanistan withdrawal seem like that.
In addition, just just tactically bombing Tehran, the the the majority of the the real danger here is that the Iranian people are not on our side, turn against us.
Uh, because what the Iranian biggest miscalculation was firing, they basically, John Stewart summarized it as two guys start beating up on you.
So what do you do?
You try and start a fight with everyone in the bar.
That was a real strategic mistake on the part of Iran.
But our potentially biggest mistake is when we're bombing Tehran, you're essentially flattening neighborhoods of people who are probably more pro-West and empathetic.
It's the kind of religious theocracies in the rural area.
So no one really trusts.
I think the why, why now and objectives had legitimacy here, and he potentially could have got 77% of Republicans are or 72% of Republicans are in favor of this, only 17% of progressive.
So let's be clear, the majority of Americans do not support this.
I don't agree with you.
I think uh this was interesting listening to this Republican, very high profile politician.
He was like, they have 15 days to g resolve this, like because if it drags on more and they don't seem to have a point, uh, it's a problem.
And one of the things he was pointing to was unaffiliated um voters.
He said this he says across there there are red lights everywhere for Republicans around independence and independents hate this.
And he said if he doesn't have a very tight, sharp plan in place, I mean he was lummox that they didn't have one, Mike that they didn't have and they they weren't communicating them.
And I'll tell you one when he had gone to that briefing about whether there really was an imminent threat, and one of the reporters asked him, Is there an in imminent threat?
And he said, Well, there's been one for 47 years.
That's what it sounded like.
Like he was like, didn't even buy their nonsensical reasons.
But you asked, you asked about the economy.
So the the decision to to go to war, in my opinion, is not what is going to be quote unquote the downfall or really hurt the Trump administration.
It's the following.
These nations could have helped shoot down.
These nations have their own military, their own intelligence.
They could have served a real valuable role in help protecting those Gulf states, achieving the objectives.
The fact that we now have a 1.1 trillion dollar military that appears to be run by incompetence.
In addition, America was the operating system.
We everyone settles their trades in dollars.
They operate on the IP agreements of America.
We largely enforce the flows of energy with our Navy, our military bases, make sure that rogue nations don't go too rogue.
We're sort of in the operating system.
Now, this decision, amongst others, specifically going about it unilaterally with no attempt to even consult Congress or our allies, all of a sudden shows the nation that used to enforce that no nation go too rogue, they're now that rogue nation.
Yeah.
But I think the real existential threat to the economy and to American prosperity is the following.
It's yet another data point that shows we used to be the cop or the protection when we hear a knock at the door.
Now we are the knock at the door.
Yeah, I get it.
It's really what's interesting is how many people are secretly not for it, right?
It's it's a really uh you do see the strength of of people pushing back now on Trump, which is really interesting, much more so all over the place, not listening to him, not going along with him.
Now, typically politicians go along with uh anybody when there's a war happening, they try not to be too difficult.
But one of the things is this further abrogation of power by the Congress, you know, in terms of where they where they and they're sitting around act talking and debating about whether they have power or not.
If I don't know if you've followed any of that, it's kind of ridiculous.
And they do, and one of the it just I think it just creates more cha chaos around Trump.
Like it's chaotic.
At the same time as all his his work, the people that work for him are incompetent, that seem more and more, and especially Pete has he seemed completely out of sorts for this.
And one of the the of course, uh there's a conspiracy theories everywhere, but one of them is that if Iran hits the United States in some way, a city, a United States city, which is entirely possible, that's what he'll use as the excuse to call martial law.
Just so you know, there's a lot of things happening all all at the same time.
And I don't I just don't, it's not good because it's chaos and Trump.
Chaos and Trump.
And so I think Trump is is the same thing as our domestic problems here with him.
It's chaos.
It's chaos and it's not thought out and it's incompetence.
Um and uh, you know, a lot there obviously the Republicans are worried about the midterms and they should.
Um the first primaries of the 2026 midterms.
Here are some of the highlights from Tuesday's elections.
In Texas, incumbent Senator John Cornyn and Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton are headed to a late May GOP Senate runoff.
The GOP clash is already the most expensive Senate primary in history, with Republicans alone racking up nearly a hundred million dollars in ad buys.
Um Trump is supposedly gonna pick one and tell the other to get out, but Ken Pax has already said he's not getting out, even if he doesn't get picked.
Um, and state representative James Tallerico beat uh representative Jasmine Crockett in Texas's Democratic Senate primary.
Let's listen to a clip from Taller Rico's victory speech.
To the billionaires who have taken over our state and taken over our country, your unchecked power is coming to an end.
Your days dividing working people are numbered.
Oh, he sounds like a guy we should hang out with.
Um good, good, good.
It was a good speech.
And actually, I have to say, Crockett uh handled the the defeat well.
Well, I they seemed to come together.
Everyone's like, we're all gonna come together.
Um, and uh they both ran really tough campaigns, and and then they they I have to say everybody acted.
The Democrats look like they're not uh in disarray, as they say.
Uh Texas Supreme Court stepped in to block a last-minute voting extension in two counties after GOP primary polling mix-ups, uh backing an appeal from Ken Paxton.
It seemed like he was just trying to create chaos.
In North Carolina, former governor Roy Cooper won the Democratic Senate primary quite easily and will face Republican Michael Watley uh for uh Senator Tom Tillis's seat in the race that could help decide Senate control.
Um so interesting stuff going on there.
A lot of people lost their jobs.
Um Dan Crenshaw lost his job.
Uh he was targeted by a billionaire, speaking of billionaires who spent enormous amounts of money to get rid of him.
Um there was a uh in North Carolina, the head of the state Senate who'd been in power for a long, long time, uh, is in a very tight race.
A lot of people losing losing their jobs like all over the place.
Um what do you think uh this means for Democrats this year and for Republicans?
It's very exciting for Democrats.
The I mean the Taller Rico race.
Uh first off, if Taller Rico wins the seat against the Republican nominee, I think he's likely or very likely to be the vice presidential pick in 2028.
Because if he w wins this and shows an ability to win in Texas, if as VP they think he could deliver Texas, it's game over for whoever's for the Democrats win.
If he could flip Texas in a presidential race, you think he should stay there for a little bit?
Get amass power.
Well, how long did how long was Obama Senator?
Yeah, that's right.
I mean, they did the VP is supposed to be the person who could take over.
It's not.
The VP is brought on to hopefully win a state that is a swing state for the most part.
Anyways, so it's exciting.
It's an exciting moment for Taller Rico.
But what's really exciting for Democrats is that through the odds, the majority or the number of Democrats turning out in a primary was in the high hundreds of thousands, seven or eight hundred thousand.
Two point one million Democrats turned out.
And the very this the the other very exciting thing is that I think it was 1.8 million Republicans turned out.
So whoever, whoever, whatever party is able to turn out more people for the primary gives you real insight into what's going to happen in the general.
Especially among Hispanics, he really pulled in and he shifted them.
And if we have the first Texas statewide Democrat elected in 20 or 30 years.
Lloyd Benson was the last one, I think.
It was Ann Richards.
No, no, she was governor.
She was governor.
There you go.
So this is an exciting, this is just a super exciting moment uh for Democrats.
So I I don't, you know, I don't I don't think you can overstate it.
All the races look to be have been closer.
The surprising stuff was some of the more some of the Republicans who lost their lost their seats.
That was very interesting.
Um I was thinking of sending some money to Paxson because I'd love to see him against Talarico, because I think that means Talarico wins.
Yeah, yeah.
Um he's refusing to get out.
I mean, who knows?
If he I mean Trump's gonna try to get him out.
Um supposedly they think Cornen is the better person to run against.
Well, he's more electable.
He's absolutely more electable.
Within the mag, it doesn't excite the MAGA groups, right?
They like Paxton.
He's backed by all the MAGA groups, all of them.
Yeah, it's uh this is look, I I looked at the results, and all I thought was, and I try to screen out my biases.
I thought there's just no getting around us.
This feels really good.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Well, see, it was really interesting.
Um, and I thought that uh Tal Rico's continued focus on the rich was really interesting.
It's really it's it's a he's got a similar vibe of obviously you would point to AOC and um Bernie, yeah.
Bernie and uh, of course, Mamdani.
Like he's like the Texas Mandani kind of thing.
Um and so you know, I kept saying, you know, if he wins, and of course Trump attacked him quite a bit, he'll be at the White House hanging out with Trump, like Trump will be hugging him, like and stuff like that, because he loves a winner, that kind of thing.
He's just the kind of person that will do pull a similar thing that Mondani did.
Well, Mundami was to his credit, Mandami was smart.
He showed that he was a pragmatist and he was willing to um he he wanted to be effective versus right and not politically grandstand, and he got that woman released.
He's he's proven to be quite pragmatic.
He's kept Jessica Tish, his police commissioner, who is very effective.
Um I just have a feeling Taller Rico's gonna have the same experience with Trump, that Trump will will bear hugging.
But the class, the the the class warfare, if you will, around the billionaire class.
So the the Gini coefficient, which is a measure of inequality, if it's zero to one.
If you're at zero, it means everyone has exactly the same amount.
If you're at one, it means one person has everything.
I think but revolution always takes on a different complexion.
I think what we have now is a series of smaller revolutions.
But when you start identifying a class of people based on their wealth, I mean that that kind of means the the revolution is coming.
And Trump and Epstein and the people Epstein surrounded himself with, it has created uh I mean, we are I mean, the revolution here might be a series of uh tax increase.
I d I don't know how it's gonna play out.
Well, let me let me just read something.
There this was in a story I read.
The richest Americans have amassed enormous wealth in recent years, while most Americans have seen theirs stagnate.
The net worth of the top 0.1% doubled from 2020 to a collective sum of 24.9 trillion dollars in the third quarter of 2025, and now accounts for 14.4% of the total household wealth according to the Federal Reserve.
That's an astonishing figure.
Well, uh yeah, the what William Gibson said about technology is true about prosperity, and that it's prosperity is here in America.
It's just not evenly distributed.
Yeah, but it's a lot of people.
And now tech and it's made us more fragile as an economy to stick to the morality of it.
10%, the top 10% of U.S.
households are now responsible for 50% of the spend.
Right.
I think tech billionaires have done so much damage to themselves in this the way they behaved, and they do act like they have unchanged.
And I think Elon Musk will go down in history as someone who really began the pushback against this because of the way the imperious and ridiculous way he conducted himself.
And all of them, all of them do.
All of them do.
Well, becoming the wealthiest man in the world such that you can cut off aid to HIV positive brothers.
That's not a good look.
Yeah, it's not a good look.
Well, anyway, congratulations to uh Telerco and others who won.
And to Jasmine Crockett, by the way.
I thought she ran a great campaign.
She went right up and then attacked uh Christy Gnome beautifully, like did a beautiful takedown of Chrissy Gnome, which is she's very good at her job.
Um I we haven't seen the last how to hope not.
I think she's great.
She really is.
Okay, Scott, let's go on a quick break.
When we come back, what Sam Altman is saying about OpenAI's deal with the Pentagon and what Dario Amoti is saying about Sam Altman.
It's pretty eviscerating.
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Scott, we're back.
OpenAI has updated its deal with the Pentagon, adding language that says uh its AI systems sh shall not be intentionally used for domestic surveillance.
CEO Sam Altman wrote it's critical to protect the civil liberties of Americans, but at an all hands meeting this week, Sam told staff that OpenAI had no control over how the Defense Department uses its software.
And while uh defending the deal in the Pentagon, he acknowledged that rolling it out so quickly made the company look, quote, opportunistic and sloppy.
That's the the approaching sloppy is the poor name of OpenAI.
Sam said it's been painful to try to do the quote right thing and then get, quote, personally crushed for it.
Oh my god, Sam.
This is so he needs to stop talking.
I've got to say.
Um it's a question of whether he's uh actually tarnished the brand too much in his actions.
Uh ChatGPT uninstalls surged 295% the day after the Pentagon deal was announced.
Clawed downloads continue to spike.
Meanwhile, Anthropic CEO Dario Modi told his staff that the Trump administration didn't like Anthropic because it hadn't given um dictator style praise to Trump.
Well, Sam has.
He really laid in to say they there's if you think Elon Musk and Sam Altman have a problem, Dario Modi and Sam Altman have a problem.
What do you think about this?
This is like a a real, oh God, something's going on over there at OpenAI that they really need to fix.
I think about it on the other side, and you know, as is people know, we're gonna be uh resistant unsubscribe in Minneapolis on Sunday.
And the way we're evolving it is we're now gonna um try and encourage people to sign up for who we think are good actors.
And the most obvious contrast here is the contrast between OpenAI and Anthropic.
And I've been saying for six months that I thought one of the biggest commercial opportunities was for a CEO basically to say no and say these are we're we're done enabling these type of this type of depraved behavior.
We're not gonna engage in the violation of Americans, Americans' rights.
And the hero we didn't think we needed is Dario Amoda.
He's basically stepped up and he said no.
And just to the point of it being a huge commercial opportunity, uh he uh anthropic immediately searched number one in the app store, and its annual recurring revenue has gone from 14 billion to 19 billion in just one week.
So this is going to be this is a big moment because what Dario and Anthropic have done, even if they don't realize it, is they're all of a sudden get gonna give a bunch of CEOs across America the confidence to start saying no.
Yeah.
Because I thought it was going to be Nike, but we said this six months ago.
It's a huge commercial opportunity.
It's got to be a tech person.
Since tech has been so in bed with Trump, it's got to be a tech person doing it.
Fair point.
But the the point is the opportunity here was for someone to just stand up and say, enough already, I'm I'm not going to, I'm done.
And I'll tell you, a lot of Republican senators really have not liked the way Heg Seth has handled.
I've been talking to a lot of them quietly, they have been saying that.
It's anti-capitalist.
Yes, it's very, they're very not disposed.
They're like, when did we become communists, essentially?
And and one of the things that'll be interesting, I mean, sort of anthropic is a little like what Tom Tillis has been doing.
He's left, but he has enormous leverage over the Trump administration now because he can say things.
And so instead, he says, this sucks to Pete Heck, Stephen Miller sucks, right?
He does say it outright.
And then others say, Well, I'm not really liking some of the things Stephen Miller.
It gives them the courage to say slightly less critical things.
And I think that's a great way to be.
And Darwin just sort of playing that role.
I get it, but he's playing the role of a heat shield in a lot of ways.
If you're on the roll, you get to make weapons for the government, it's legal.
If you're palantir, you get to sell data to the government as long as it's legal and uh for whatever purposes they might use it for.
And if you're anthropic, you get to work with who you want.
You can't do it based on you can't discriminate or not work with people based on their sexual orientation or their ethnicity, but they can absolutely you you can decide we can we get to decide who we take ads from.
We we we say no all the time to advertisers and say no, we're not comfortable with it.
Uh the op what the the big thing here is that in one week, uh Claude went from number 42 to number one in the free app store.
So this is uh I mean, this is a big moment.
This is a turning point because I just trust me on this.
In the next 30 days, all of a sudden we're gonna see these these CEOs cosplaying Nelson Mandela and acting all righteous.
I don't know.
I don't know about that.
One of the things that was interesting, there was a poll out in Emerson poll.
I can't remember that wasn't Emerson, it was a it was a more uh normal poll.
Um, that said that people want CEOs to remain neutral, but they also want them to be genuine.
So they kind of like this, you know, even though they say they don't want companies to weigh in, they kind of do, which is interesting.
People answer differently.
I do think people do vote like with resistance unsubscribe.
If you don't like how chat GPT, I so many people have told me they have dumped Chat GPT more than any of the other ones, and Amazon would be the second one when they come up to me to ask me about your efforts with resistant unsubscribe.
It's always Amazon and and OpenAI that they focus in on.
That's what I've noticed.
But we haven't had an option to the upside.
We haven't had a carrot just to stick.
Great idea.
And this has given everyone the ability to say, all right, my lack of spending is a signal, but my spending can also be a signal.
And I think there's a big opportunity here.
And I'm personally gonna urge people to sign up for and patronize anthropic and to unsubscribe and not use open AI and send a very strong signal that people notice.
And when certain companies stand up at potentially, you know, potentially pretty severe risk of retribution from the largest customer in the world.
It is, it still is.
There's all kinds of second-order effects of Palantir uses Claude.
A lot of people use Claude.
100%.
It's a real risk.
It might cost them in the short run.
Well, there's a there's a lawsuit too.
Over the medium and the long term, I believe this is one of the biggest commercial opportunities uh presented to companies right now.
Yeah, we'll see where it goes.
Um the the issue, let me just make a warning for Anthropic.
Dario, who is a typical tech tech person, arrogant.
It can be arrogant and um imperious kind of thing.
He loves to write, which I I appreciate.
I like him.
I like a CEO that does really is a good writer, actually.
Um he's got to be careful not to appear too righteous, right?
Too self-righteous.
I think that's where I'm I think it should go dark and just let his action speak for his words.
Yeah, exactly.
I think there is that, you know, that he's definitely getting attacked by the idiot Emile Michael and David Sachs, the other moron.
Um again, government government officials deciding that we're now, like you said, central planning.
Yeah.
It's another data point you asked about the economy.
Every time we diminish the rule of law, everyone is entitled to and subject to the same laws.
Every time we say, okay, the the law is now a tool for political retribution based on who's in power.
We lose m we are price earnings multiple on the SP goes down.
He's more powerful.
Tom Darry Modi is more powerful now than he was because he's the only one, right?
And the same thing with the Tom Tillis.
He has more leverage now in his 300 days left, because it gives the gives people permission to be to push back, you know, maybe not he gets to be the louder one, both of them, and it'll it'll be interesting.
It'll be all over the place.
Um speaking of not pushing back, FCC Chair Brendan Carr, who I love to call a moron, because he is, says he expects the Warner Brothers Paramount merger deal to get through approval pretty quickly.
Of course, you lapdog.
Let's listen to what he said when asked about whether he would have concerns about the Netflix deal.
There's a lot of concerns in DC, and you can see it already.
Just the scope and scale and the streaming service in particular, they would add a very difficult path forward from regulatory perspective.
This deal uh is a lot cleaner, does not raise at all the same types of concerns.
I think there's some real consumer benefits that could emerge from it.
He's right about it.
It was obviously it's a smaller.
That's that's right, Brandon.
But Brandon has nothing to do with this deal, and he always mouths off on everything.
Um meanwhile, Fitch Ratings, one of the Wall Street's big credit rating agencies, has cut Paramount's credit ratings to junk status, no surprise, enormous debt.
I think from 75 to 100 billion dollars in debt.
It's a big, it's a big chunk of money.
They say they're gonna deleverage quickly, but it's always hard, as Bill Cohen noted.
Um and David Zasloff, also not looking so good, president and CEO of Warner's.
He's looking good to shareholders, filed to sell over 114 million dollars worth of stock in a company.
He's getting pilloried by because it's very clear that um that uh Paramount will have to cut.
They say six billion, it's much higher.
Uh, you know, I carr does not play a role here, just for people to understand a real role.
Um, but it will get through.
It probably will, you know, they've been working Europe, they've been working the government.
Um it's just a question of how they get through and and what damage uh they have done by doing this very non-economic deal.
Um any more thoughts on that?
When the book on the worst acquisitions in history is written, it should just be called Warner Brothers.
That's true.
I mean, if you if you ra if you ran into Time Warner executives in 2005, Steve Kay's super smart.
He realized that AOL had nowhere near the value it was trading at.
So he said, this is a time to trade it in for boring revenues that come from records and books and parks and movies.
And if you find a Time Warner executive two or three years later, literally their retirements were ruined because of what was the worst acquisition in history, and that's Time Warner's merger with AOL.
And AOL within like 36 months was worth 10% of what Time Warner had to pay for it and give up.
And then ATT bought Time Warner and then barely and then had to take a had to take a haircut.
And then Time Warner merged with Discovery, and basically it turned into just a giant uh public benefit organization.
It's like basically the merger between Discovery and Warner Brothers is if David Zoslov had been honest, he would have stood up and said, look, this can make me almost a billionaire, regardless of whether I destroy or make shareholder value.
He certainly didn't improve it.
It did not, it's underperformed the SP by any stretch of the imagination.
He's a brilliant investment banker, and he's gonna walk away with $700 million.
Whatever.
It's legal.
Good for him.
Shareholders.
What I don't get is if I was Netflix, I would be, I'd be much meaner or more Machiavellian, and I'd be trying to fire up as many Democratic lawmakers as possible.
I think they are.
I think probably they are.
They're saying a lot of public, you know, uh Jerry Cardinali, who's one of the investors, tried to clap back at Netflix.
All the all the I've talked to some Paramount executives, and they're all unions.
I don't get I can't get over.
Paramount executive's like Netflix has got sort sour grapes.
I'm like, they're accurate sour grapes.
Like, sorry.
I think it's very effective by slapping them, you know, making them a villain.
But yeah, I agree.
The unions, why it's gonna be AX and also uh Edgar Bronfman, Sherry Redstone, and now David Ellison.
There's a general trend throughout history where dad makes a shit ton of money through grid and creativity, and then dad junior loses it.
Yeah, but basically the only ones who are willing.
Rupert Murdoch.
Rupert Murdoch took his dad, but that was like a smaller.
Oh no, he he I mean he was a rich kid, but he turned his father's into an empire.
And in anyways, this anyone involved in media now is basically a billionaire's kid looking to go to the Oscars and make the family 80% less wealthy.
Yeah, it's true.
And that's what Brompman did.
That's what Sherry Redstone did.
He's definitely doing that.
And that's that's what David Ellison is about to do.
Well, he has a lot of money, so there's a lot to lose.
He really, really, really likes making movies, Scott.
This company, this company is gonna be, they're gonna try to go to AI to cut re to cut, uh, I think, and I think you're gonna see a lot of AI slop.
I think the creative community is gonna turn on them.
Yeah, I think this is gonna be very uh I would not want to own those bonds right now unless they're senior secured in the stack.
Uh, but I think this is gonna be very difficult.
And and of course they're gonna get a lot of attention with the news thing, even though it's a smaller part of the empire.
Um, you know, they're gonna be a big thing.
I wouldn't be surprised if they sell it.
I I don't think I I don't I've never bought they want to I know for sure they're merging ZBS and CNN.
They have to they it's economically untenable not to do so.
I would hope they would put Mark Thompson in charge of the whole thing.
I think he's a really good person and be very well liked.
I can tell you it's hair on fire over at CNN in terms of being I get I get like like covered with CNN what's happening Kara what's happening Karen I have some knowledge I will say but they're definitely uh merging um merging the two of them I there's no other choice for them to I think they should have CNN anchors on Survivor the CNN show.
Dana Bash oh my God she would so we should win Caitlin Collins would kill them all you think oh no I think Dana Bash I think Dana Bash is the kind of person that would smother you in your sleep if she needed to really I feel like Caitlin Collins did you see her like kicking the kick in the press secretary's ass.
I think there's a very dark interesting side to Dana.
Okay all right but we know we don't care and I'm here for it Dana by the way I'm here for it.
No Jake probably will get got gotten Anderson, of course, is so sweet.
Um, I'm trying to think if there's an outside person.
Bruno.
I don't know.
There's a lot of people there.
There's a lot of people.
I'm I'm going to vote Caitlin Collins.
You can bite Dana Bash.
But we definitely think uh Anderson and Jake will be will be off we'll be will be dinner.
I think Fare just opens a bar on the island and says, I'm done.
I'm done.
I'm sick of telling people what's going to happen.
Stack rank the survivability on an island of CNN anchors.
Oh, that's so funny.
Yeah, who wins in Survivor?
CNN survivor.
They're literally gonna have to do sh create.
Survivor, the CNN edition.
Uh Scott, what do we do with Scott Jennings?
What do you where do you put him?
Oh, he's killed by his own troops.
He's like, he's they they I mean, yeah, no, but he's the guy he's the guy they bury they bury up to his neck in sand and let's let the tide come in slowly.
They're like, is there a fire ant?
I don't dislike the is there a fire ant hill on the island?
We have an idea for Scott.
This is I know it's kind of sick, but it's such a funny idea to have something like this.
No, we have Michael Smirkanish leading campfire songs at the end of night to make everyone feel good.
We have AC360, that guy who who substitute for Anderson.
He just has to walk around with his shirt off.
He's hot.
He just has to walk around with his shirt off.
Okay.
I've got it all planned.
If uh Ellison's call me.
I take back everything I've said.
I have a way to pay off the code.
Let us run.
You should let us run.
Survivor, the CNN edition.
I'm telling you, Kegel and Collins will take them all down.
All right, Scott, let's go on a quick break when we come back.
The return of the burger wars.
This is right near wheelhouse.
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An atomlose yagd feared Maggie and Kai quer to Europa.
As the let's in your art won't see the murderish bluedost an end set.
Dunkel, unheimlich intensive.
Oder brooch Staffel 2.
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Scott, we're back with more news.
Burger King and McDonald's have some social media beef.
I can't believe I just read that.
McDonald's posted a video of its CEO eating the company's Big Arch uh burger last month.
And while he says he was taking a big bite, the bite was small.
He also called it the product.
Uh the video went viral because of the discrepancy.
And then on the day of the release of the Big Arch, Burger King posted a video of its president eating a Whopper Burger in a more enthusiastic fashion than the rest of them.
There's a Wendy's one, I think there's a Taco Bell.
I don't know.
There's so many of them now.
Um, and and while it was what did you think?
Very briefly, what did you think of this?
It's kind of fascinating.
It really took off the burger eating situation.
It was McDonald's and Burger King, and then the other Wendy's got involved.
They're they're all in there.
They're all in there.
Funny?
Stupid.
Well, what no one wanted to talk about was.
There was a CEO of McDonald's who I think died of colorectal cancer in his late 40s.
Um I don't Yeah, that that's a real pick me up story.
Oh, thanks, God.
Um, I don't know why I brought that up.
I don't know.
I what what do you I could not be less interested in the story other than to say that other than to say that as as I'm sure you are, I've been talking to all these presidents, uh presidential candidates who call me for ideas, which is their way of saying send me money.
I'm like, negotiate, buy a billion doses of of a GLP one drink uh drug.
Right.
Yeah, actually, these businesses are underseas.
You're absolutely right.
Distributed to rural communities.
Uh if you wanna, if you want to solve the deficit, all roads lead to health care.
If we want to reduce health care costs, all roads, in my opinion, lead to GLP one, and that the best investment we could make.
I I think I think fast food, by the way, I I gotta be honest.
I look forward the only thing I'm the only thing I like about travel is if I'm at an airport, I grant myself the luxury of eating McDonald's.
I have a general rule.
I don't eat fast food or go to strip bars in cities I live in because that could just go bad places.
So, but when I'm at the airport, the McDonald's in Newark is the best McDonald's in the world.
You like in and out too in Shake Shack.
Oh, that's not even fast food.
That's that's that's the best meal in the world.
It is, you're right.
That's literally the best meal.
Well, then let me get on this.
We're on food chains.
RFK Jr.
question what's in Dunkin' Donuts products in Massachusetts is not having it.
Governor Mora Healy posted an image with a Duncan cup saying, come and take it.
Others are having fun with uh the the jab on social media saying things like if this administration changes anything that goes into Duncan, I will make January 6th look like a tea party.
Um, you know, it's interesting they're going after brands, like well, RFK's another moron.
Um it's it's interesting because remember when Bloomberg did this with the co with the sugar?
It wasn't good, it wasn't a good minute for him.
No, the big gulp.
The big gulp.
What do you what do you think about this?
I think Duncan is not a good thing to go after.
I feel like people really like that Dunkin' Donuts.
They really do.
And they know they know it's full of sugar.
They're aware.
America runs on Duncan, Kara.
Um look, I I think people have the right to kill themselves.
And if they want to do it slowly with McDonald's and Duncan, that's kind of their opportunity.
I think the government has an obligation to go the other way and provide more education.
70% of Americans are obese or overweight.
It's like 38% or obese.
In Japan, it's 4%.
And it starts very early.
They have every public school has to have a nutritionist, and they are not allowed to have any processed food, and everything has to be made fresh in the morning.
Same thing in Korea.
There's a whole scene in my documentary with in me in a Korean school eating their food.
It's astonishing.
And you ask these kids what their favorite food is, they're like broccoli.
Yes.
No, they were like, oh, this kimchi here.
It was it was a fermented food.
It was miso soup, it was rice, certainly.
It was, it was so good.
It was so healthy, it was crazy.
And they end up paying $6,000 or $7,000 per consumer on healthcare, and we pay $13,000, folks.
Let's do the math.
So I don't like, I don't like demonizing.
Like I like McDonald's, I like Dunkin' Donuts.
I like to think that because of education early on, I I got some, you know, I'm not sure.
You're fully aware of eating the right foods.
Also, the reality is fast food is a function of poverty.
And that is, or or uh going back to the same income inequality.
And that is if you're a single mother, the cheapest caloric intake is fast food.
And people people want to get moral and lecture people about the importance of cooking at home and cooking with good food.
Actually, the the myth is that cooking at home saves you money.
No, it's not.
To cook at home with natural ingredients is really expensive.
It is.
And also time, a lot of people have two jobs.
Or food deserts.
Yeah.
Uh but again, I'm I I've said this before.
I think the most transformative technology over the next five or ten years is not AI.
I think it's GLP1.
But uh love McDonald's.
Think people should have the right to kill themselves fast or slow if they want.
But I think a really good investment would be giving people enough money and enough education such that they want to and can afford to eat well.
Yeah.
But I have to say, I wouldn't go up against Morohealy.
Not if I were you RFK.
She's a tough nut.
She's a big basketball player.
I don't know if you know that.
She's a very good one.
Um, anyway, uh, we'll see what our event, right?
She did.
Yeah, she's great.
I love her.
And we met her wife.
Yes.
Um, anyway, we'll see where it goes.
But it's really interesting that that these these I have to say, it some of the brands on social media are really interesting.
Um, and uh some of them are better than the Wendy's does an amazing job, for example, online.
Well, you know what Peter Pan's favorite place to eat out is.
Where?
Where is Wendy's?
Oh God.
I can't believe you have a dirty joke about Wendy's.
Oh, God.
All right, Scott, one more quick break.
We'll be back for predictions.
So everyone knows our politics are divided.
There's left versus right, and dividing lines on age, gender, or race.
But maybe our biggest divide in our politics isn't about identity at all.
It's insiders versus outsiders.
At least that's what Congressman Rokana would say.
The real issue is two tiers of justice in America.
The real issue is people with power and wealth using it uh to uh be above the law and escape even investigation or prosecution.
And it's only gotten more noticeable in recent months, as issues like the Epstein files and artificial intelligence have seemed to pit the elites against everybody else.
California Congressman Rokana takes on the Epstein class.
Today explain in your feed every weekday, and now on Saturdays, too.
After decapitation strikes against Iran's leadership, what can we expect next in the escalating war?
The big question is if there is going to be a next strongman in Iran, what kind of strongman will that person likely be?
I don't think that there's going to be another powerful cleric, supreme leader.
I'm John Finer.
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And we're the hosts of The Long Game, a weekly national security podcast.
This week we sit down with Kareem Sajapur to discuss what to expect in this next phase of the war against Iran.
The episode's out now.
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Hi, this is Kara Swisher.
And this week on my podcast, On with Kara Swisher, I talked to California Governor Gavin Newsom.
Well, he isn't officially announced or run for president yet.
He's telegraphing it all the time.
It's exhausting.
He's also got a new book out, which is what you do when you're running for president.
It's called Young Man in a Hurry.
I recently interviewed him live in San Francisco.
Have a listen.
The problem with the Democratic Party so often is we appear weak.
And we've got to be stronger and we've got to be more assertive.
And so that's, you know, it's the spirit, I think, that is required of this moment.
I've known Gavin Newsom since he was mayor of San Francisco a million years ago, a million hair gels ago.
And he's a really interesting and compelling politician.
He's done a lot of things in his career.
And this one, this run for presidency, which is going to happen, is among the most interesting.
You can find a full conversation wherever you get your podcast.
And on YouTube, obviously, be sure to follow and subscribe to On with Kara Swisher for more.
Okay, Scott, um, let's hear a prediction.
I have something very quickly to say in the prediction department.
I uh if for people who didn't notice, there was a story uh again on uh bots about uh problems with wrongful deaths and suicides.
This time it's Google with Gemini AI chatbot coached a man towards suicide, and it is the story is devastating.
This is an adult, not a child, not a young person, not at someone underage, but uh it's still just as devastating it what it did and what it told him to do, and it made him go to places and look for things in order to find a robot to put this digital girlfriend into.
Um I have to say I I predict some really significant legislation around this in a way that is probably gonna be too reactive and at the same time it necessary because of the way these companies are conducting their their chatbots that interact with people on a personal level.
And they have done nothing to rein the man.
Um and so I think there's gonna be a flood of things around how we interact with technology uh that's gonna be bipartisan and pretty ugly for the tech companies.
Yeah, and I didn't mean to make light of fast food.
There was that mass shooting at a fast food restaurant where the guy was screaming, you've ordered your last mick rib, and then one of the workers said, Sir, this is a Wendy's.
Oh my god.
That's so wrong, Cara.
It's so wrong.
That's so wrong.
Anyway, what's your prediction?
I want to take some license here, and I wanted to talk, I wanted to do kind of a fail in a win.
And that is, I just I watched, I'm one of my living heroes is uh Madame uh Secretary Clinton.
Yeah, it's the only person I've ever canvassed for.
And uh when I saw I watched her entire testimony, I just thought the level of sexism was so fucking insane.
Um, and that is um, so first off, when is the last time a man was asked repeatedly to explain his wife's behavior or actions?
And the this is the absurdity of holding wives accountable for husbands.
And here's what's so incredibly fucked up about this.
We live in a world they ought to be responsible for you, Suka.
We live in a world where a woman with her own 50 year career in public service, senator, secretary of state, presidential candidate, gets hauled in front of a committee and asked to explain what her husband did, not what you did, what he did.
And also there's this implicit assumption that, like, and why didn't you stop him?
And we've seen the same bullshit for decades.
When a powerful man does something wrong, we turn to his wife and ask, Where were you?
Why didn't you know?
Why didn't you leave him?
Why are you still with him?
And we never ask the inverse.
When a woman in power screws up, we don't haul her husband in and ask him to explain her choices.
We don't demand he account for her behavior.
We don't ask, why did you stay with her?
Because implicit in all this is this we We do ask that, but go ahead.
Implicit in all of this is this assumption that men are autonomous agents responsible for their own actions, which is right.
Whereas women are responsible for everyone's actions, including their husbands.
The double standard is staggering.
If if if Hillary had left Bill after the Lewinsky scandal, she'd have been called a calculating opportunist who who abandoned him and that it was politically convenient.
If she stays with him, she's complicit in everything he's ever done.
So i I just think it's insane that they kept asking her questions when he was testifying the next fucking day.
Well, ask him.
She handled it beautifully.
Yeah, I agree.
So now, just to piss off the Brooklyn Sandaled or Birkenstock crowd on the other side, there is absolutely a double standard for women when it comes to asking them to explain obvious discretions or conflicts of interest.
Watching the exchange, basically saying, are you having sex with or are you in an extramarital?
And I'm gonna be clear, I'm not judging them on having an extramarital affair or having sex.
When you're having a relationship with your number two who is unqualified, uh that is reason to be fired at any organization, any corporation, much less a cabinet position.
And and what the exchange reminded me of was how selectively we apply accountability and politics.
And as someone who considers them a feminist, that means you're subject to the same opportunities and also you're entitled to the same amount of shit as everybody else.
And when male politicians face questions about personal conduct, the expectation is clear.
Answer the fucking question.
And when they dodge, the press and the opposition usually press harder until they either deny it or outright until they deny it or admit it.
Evasion becomes the story.
But when a woman, Secretary Gnome, respond to a direct question about a relationship, uh, calling it total garbage and declining to actually say no, the moment largely passed without the same relentless follow-up.
It will float away because of this double standard of being accused of slut shaming.
This is sexism the other way.
If a male cabinet secretary responded that way to a similar question, the headlines would read, refuses to deny, and the questioning wouldn't stop.
So there is sexism asking women to take responsibility for their husbands, but at the same time, there was a l the uh double standard and a lack of accountability amongst women for the same types of things where the press and and other lawmakers would not let up.
God, I'm so preachy today.
I know.
I I think lawmakers did did not let up.
I think they said it I've got to be a few.
It's over, it's done.
They are not, they are doing their job.
They did ask, and they asked several times.
So yeah.
If this had been Bill Clinton or another, it would be it would be ongoing until they clarified their comments.
I'm gonna say you're right about the media.
I'd say I think they they asked as hard as they could, and she just refused.
She went on.
See, I think I think they should have said the following.
And it's easy to pick one in a quarterback.
I think one of them should have said, you are having an inappropriate relationship with your number two who is unqualified, and this puts the nation at risk.
I would have backed her into a fucking corner.
That's fair.
So I'll move on.
Um real quick.
My prediction is no.
And that is Dario Amoti has given license and permission to CEOs to say no.
And in the next 30 days, you are going to see a raft of CEOs find their testicles and start saying no to this administration.
No, there's gonna be a lot of that.
I agree with you 100%.
Um, speaking of yes, we will be in Minnesota, everybody.
Just so you know, we're gonna be there on Sunday night, and we are very excited, and we're very excited to do this show.
It'll be a pivot show, and at the same time, we're gonna talk a lot about resist and unsubscribe, and Scott's got some tricks up his sleeve.
We've got some special guests, secret guests.
Uh, we're sold out.
Um, so it's not like we're selling it, but we're we're very excited to do it and raise money for uh a legal organization that uh helps immigrants there.
Um anyway, we want to hear from you.
Send us your question about business tech or whatever's on your mind.
Go to ny mag.com slash pivot to submit a question for the show or call 855-51 pivot.
Elsewhere in the Karen Scott universe this week on Prof.
Markets, Scott spoke with big short legend Steve Eisman about why he thinks the war in Iran is unlikely to rattle markets and why the bigger risk uh investors should be watching again is AI.
Let's listen to a clip.
Everything that's being created by people who are doing AI has value.
The question is, how much value?
So much money is being spent.
Are the returns that these companies are going to generate?
Are they going to justify those returns?
I suspect not.
If I had to stake my life on it, I'd say we'd have some kind of replay where, you know, in the internet bubble, the first generation of internet companies basically failed.
And it was the second generation of internet companies that that took us on to glory in terms of the value of the internet.
Very good.
Very sensible.
That makes sense.
Okay, that's the show.
Thanks for listening to Pivot and be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel.
We'll be back next week with an episode, as I said, taped live in Minneapolis.
Scott, I can't believe we did it.
I mean, we just thought about it on the show and then we made it so an idea, and it's happened.
And again, thank you to all our staff for helping us here.
And of course, to Tane Danger in Minneapolis, who's been really amazing.
We're very excited to come.
We're gonna have a uh hooped up show and and and have a lot of fun with people in Minnesota.
They deserve all the fun they can get.
Uh, Scott.
Well, you have to read us out.
I'm so sorry.
Oh, thanks.
Yeah.
Where am I?
Where am I?
Reheat my soup.
Today's show was produced by Larry Namon, Joey Marcus, and Taylor Griffin.
Earning your Todd Engineer this episode, Manola Moreno edited the video.
Thanks also to Drew Burroughs, Mill Severio, and Dan Shallon.
Nishak Current's Vox Media's executive producer podcast.
Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform.
Thanks for listening to Pivot from New York magazine of Ox Media.
You can subscribe to the magazine at nymag.com slash pod.
We'll be back next week for another breakdown of all things tech and business.
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